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 Post subject: Re: Now we can all sound like Ben Klock....
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 4:44 pm 
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The reverb kick comes from subzero being alkaloid 2 kick.

Also for example this:



Or this:



Its not ostgut but dettmann so ostgut for everybody...

When I talk reverb kick I also mean to take a normal unreverbed techno or tech-house kick sample and underpinning it with a veryyy rumbly type of sample. (But this also works with reverb kicks as top source laying stuff beneath it)
In Maschine there are a few of these lying around in the subkick folder. They don't have a click anymore and you just lay them underneath. I recently came across this by looking at example projects in maschine. (I am not a NI affiliate)
I just got tired of creating own drums i really enjoy using premade stuff except for loops.
Samples, drum kits, synth presets in massive from expansion sets. Gets inspiration flowing. I dont care about creativity, the output counts. 8-)

I know ostgut is not only reverb kick. But people like pinning things down. Including myself.
How funny would it be to describe the ostgut sound to someone as " yea sort of has some tracks with reverb and some without and yea then theres steffi and virginia with house kicks and matthew styles coming from house and doing modular house stuff". Nobody would listen to you. Instead you say "yea ostgut = reverb techno" period..


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 Post subject: Re: Now we can all sound like Ben Klock....
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 5:22 pm 
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dubdub wrote:
I've never understood where the Ostgut = reverb kick association came from honestly, aside from Subzero there are very few tracks on that label with the big reverb kick rumble. It's a stereotype that never really existed but somehow still spawned a million shitty "Ostgut" imitators.


Yep.

Bradley1602 wrote:
Instead you say "yea ostgut = reverb techno" period..


What about Tresor, Blueprint or old Gabber labels? :twisted:

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 Post subject: Re: Now we can all sound like Ben Klock....
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 5:45 pm 
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Quote:
What about Tresor, Blueprint or old Gabber labels? :twisted:


Yea this was not intended to insult anyone. I know that reverb techno is 90s origin and ceartanly not ostgutton exclusive . Its just not graspable for most people to think back as far and most of them just don't know. berghain techno is just a definition like lofi house.

Personally whats really interesting and what I have just have no clue about is what will be next. Minimal into house into techno and then?

If this all goes in cycles it should be clear what will be the next station on it.


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 Post subject: Re: Now we can all sound like Ben Klock....
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:03 pm 
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Bradley1602 wrote:

Yea this was not intended to insult anyone.


No need to be so considerate. I was hoping for you to insult people!

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 Post subject: Re: Now we can all sound like Ben Klock....
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:03 pm 
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Lame.


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 Post subject: Re: Now we can all sound like Ben Klock....
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:25 pm 
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I don't see the drama. It's a sample pack for something they obviously think there is some demand for- congratulations techno is mainstream!


Bradley1602 wrote:
I dont care about creativity, the output counts.


That's really depressing.

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 Post subject: Re: Now we can all sound like Ben Klock....
PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 11:22 pm 
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Bradley1602 wrote:
But Wave Alchemy is not one of them because they didn't deliver rumble reverb kick.
I think they are obsessed with being totally different than everybody else and hence make funny sounding weird stuff.
Wave Alchemy Revolution is different. Thats a good product, but for beatport modern techno unusable. (There are other things on beatport except drumcode)

Regarding Wave Alchemy,
I never understood why so many people are such huge fans of them.
I think they are difficult to integrate into productions for some reason, although one can clearly here they treated the samples excessively with luxury gear and a lot of thought.
But all their packs sound like funny takes on the genres they are trying to melt with. Every time I listen to a pack-demo by them I think "yeaaaa not nailed this".
In comparison if i listen to a native-instruments demo pack there are higher chances of at least thinking "yes this could possibly be good ingredient for that genre".


I use WA drum machine samples all the time, and they are fantastic, but these are single hits processed through analog gear. No loops. And I'm not really using them for techno, but for synthwave.


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 Post subject: Re: Now we can all sound like Ben Klock....
PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 12:44 am 
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Planar wrote:
I don't see the drama. It's a sample pack for something they obviously think there is some demand for- congratulations techno is mainstream!


Bradley1602 wrote:
I dont care about creativity, the output counts.


That's really depressing.



Utterly.
One of the most depressing things I have read when discussing an artform.
The only response I can think of is..... Just fuck off.
IF all you care about is results, if the act of creation or expression is not a motivator, it is merely and literally just a product.
Literally worst thing anyone could say to me in a discussion about making music, that`s the end of the conversation, I have nothing more to say to the person.

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 Post subject: Re: Now we can all sound like Ben Klock....
PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 2:47 am 
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Hmm. I don't think you can separate creativity from the end result. If the end result is good, then there was creativity involved. I mean, yes--I agree that, ultimately, what matters is the end product, but if you are uncreative in how you make something, like just using loops, then the end product isn't going to be very good. Am I making sense?

Putting it another way, I don't see any problem with using a kick sample from NI, WA or whoever--or a 909, or Valhalla reverbs--just because lots of people do them. But you do need to do something with them that's interesting. And if you are just layering 4 loops from a sample pack, then you aren't doing anything interesting. There needs to be feeling and feeling goes into every minute decision. Lazy music will sound lazy.


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 Post subject: Re: Now we can all sound like Ben Klock....
PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 8:47 am 
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Good morning,

Hm yes i guess the creativity output thing sounds quite like greedyness for money, fame and power.
I think the product counts.
Because at the end of the day, personally that is it what will make me happy. Having an outcome that I am satisfied with. If i made it creatively or not, I don't care.

If it satisfies my will to make the music I love, i do care.

Creativity may be there or not I am just not wasting a single thought about it.
The only thing that counts is getting your desired result and if that works by using vengeance loops, I am totally on your side.

In the past i overthought everything just to learn painfully that everything already lies on the table and the table is already cramped up with stuff, no need for me to further put things on it. Instead grab the things that lie on it abd create something.

And I absolutely don't agree you have to do do something with samples everybody uses. It's not about layering stuff or processing but about simple essential techniques and formulas that define your preferred style of music.


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 Post subject: Re: Now we can all sound like Ben Klock....
PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 10:59 am 
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Bradley1602 wrote:
In the past i overthought everything just to learn painfully that everything already lies on the table and the table is already cramped up with stuff, no need for me to further put things on it. Instead grab the things that lie on it abd create something.


Well that's a pretty classic definition of creativity.



Okay I was trying to make a little bit of a joke before... I feel like I gave off a vibe of being extremely angry here behind my screen.

I don't really care about these sample packs (and has been said before they aren't the first ones).

What I do think is a little sad, is that these sample packs crystallizes a scene into a very narrow definition (techno composed with the use of the sounds in the sample packs). I think that can be limiting.

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 Post subject: Re: Now we can all sound like Ben Klock....
PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 11:58 am 
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Lost to the Void wrote:
IF all you care about is results, if the act of creation or expression is not a motivator, it is merely and literally just a product.


"I hate writing, I love having written." - Dorothy Parker

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 Post subject: Re: Now we can all sound like Ben Klock....
PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 12:40 pm 
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"I just want to be famous, I don't care how I get there"

Paris Whoreton, Kim Kuntdashian etc etc

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 Post subject: Re: Now we can all sound like Ben Klock....
PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 1:03 pm 
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Love making beats, hate beats that cant compete with my favourite artists beats


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 Post subject: Re: Now we can all sound like Ben Klock....
PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 1:18 pm 
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Bradley1602 wrote:
Love making beats, hate beats that cant compete with my favourite artists beats


that's ok, because nowadays you can just take an entire track,
pitch it up (or was it down ? can never remember the brilliance of that production move),
put a kick underneath,
and call it a day and have some well known label release it !!

When you get caught,
*you can say you just found the wav on youtube
*you got the wav sent to you by a friend
*your friend has a "Blue Moog" which explains the title of the track you stole it from :lol:
*your friend and you had a fall-out and he doesn't have internet anyway, so sadly enough, he can't vouch for what happened...

:lol: :lol: :lol:

And the worst part is that people all over the internet will go berserk on you,
and then forget not even 3 months later and continue as if that shit never happened.

It's such an important life lesson if you get caught steeling other people's creativity :
just lie, deny everything, no matter how obvious the evidence is.
Kind of like when your mrs walks in and you got your dick inside another woman's honeytrap.
"ugh, honey, I just happened to fall, and there just happened to be a pretty naked woman on the floor who was kind enough to break my fall" 8-)

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 Post subject: Re: Now we can all sound like Ben Klock....
PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 1:24 pm 
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Hades wrote:
Bradley1602 wrote:
Love making beats, hate beats that cant compete with my favourite artists beats


that's ok, because nowadays you can just take an entire track,
pitch it up (or was it down ? can never remember the brilliance of that production move),
put a kick underneath,
and call it a day and have some well known label release it !!

When you get caught,
*you can say you just found the wav on youtube
*you got the wav sent to you by a friend
*your friend has a "Blue Moog" which explains the title of the track you stole it from :lol:
*your friend and you had a fall-out and he doesn't have internet anyway, so sadly enough, he can't vouch for what happened...

:lol: :lol: :lol:

And the worst part is that people all over the internet will go berserk on you,
and then forget not even 3 months later and continue as if that shit never happened.

It's such an important life lesson if you get caught steeling other people's creativity :
just lie, deny everything, no matter how obvious the evidence is.
Kind of like when your mrs walks in and you got your dick inside another woman's honeytrap.
"ugh, honey, I just happened to fall, and there just happened to be a pretty naked woman on the floor who was kind enough to break my fall" 8-)


You stole that



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 Post subject: Re: Now we can all sound like Ben Klock....
PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 1:55 pm 
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Hades wrote:
Bradley1602 wrote:
Love making beats, hate beats that cant compete with my favourite artists beats


that's ok, because nowadays you can just take an entire track,
pitch it up (or was it down ? can never remember the brilliance of that production move),
put a kick underneath,
and call it a day and have some well known label release it !!

When you get caught,
*you can say you just found the wav on youtube
*you got the wav sent to you by a friend
*your friend has a "Blue Moog" which explains the title of the track you stole it from :lol:
*your friend and you had a fall-out and he doesn't have internet anyway, so sadly enough, he can't vouch for what happened...

:lol: :lol: :lol:

And the worst part is that people all over the internet will go berserk on you,
and then forget not even 3 months later and continue as if that shit never happened.

It's such an important life lesson if you get caught steeling other people's creativity :
just lie, deny everything, no matter how obvious the evidence is.
Kind of like when your mrs walks in and you got your dick inside another woman's honeytrap.
"ugh, honey, I just happened to fall, and there just happened to be a pretty naked woman on the floor who was kind enough to break my fall" 8-)


The sad thing is how true this is. Not even sarcasm, this is just facts.
Cunt let cuts get away with anything as long as there is something in it for them.

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 Post subject: Re: Now we can all sound like Ben Klock....
PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 2:40 pm 
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I know.
the guy literally contacted me on FB PM when I had responded to a post from Mono saying how he couldn't believe people were booking this guy again only 2 months or so after what had happened.
I agreed it was insane, and a thief is still a thief,
and next thing I know the guy himself contacts me, asking "what is your problem ?"
"you being a thief !" (as if that needed to be explained somehow)
honestly, I even had quite a nice chat with the guy, but he's still a fucking thief,
and the excuses he came up with...
like that "blue Moog" thing, haha :lol:
and his friend wasn't his friend any more and he didn't have internet either and blablabla...
yeah yeah...

but I already mentioned this shit on subsekt before.

some people have ethics, some people don't have ethics,
I know that and I can live with it,
and it's kind of inherent to "steal" little parts if you consider the whole sample history in electronic music,
but if you steal an entire track, and you're still looking for excuses afterwards...
I'm sorry, but call me conservative, but that shit is just fucked up,
and if he would have at least admitted, he would have been more of a man in my opinion than he is now...

But yeah, most people just don't seem to care about ethics in electronic music.
So much of it has become pure hedonism, and the music just a product.

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 Post subject: Re: Now we can all sound like Ben Klock....
PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 3:11 pm 
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Thief and a liar, two of those strikes and I no longer want to support you in any way.
People will suck satans cock for a release on his label though......

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 Post subject: Re: Now we can all sound like Ben Klock....
PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 3:12 pm 
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