Arrangement Warz

Electronic Music Production // Dark Arts
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Críoch
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Arrangement Warz

Post by Críoch »

Inspiring reading a few posts on here recently 8-)

Mainly Stace's thread on 'Finding My Way Back'

http://subsekt.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=11167

& also some comments on choosing / balancing elements in a track by Fourty Two, dubdub & Borg (Starts 6 posts down) :

http://subsekt.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=10985&start=60


Over the last week or so I've been getting the kids looking at Ableton. Kids off school due to the C19 / Pandemic lolz.

My 11 son was due to be starting a online production course using Soundtrap (Spotify owned web browser DAW - pretty decent/ full featured TBF). I wanted to whet his appetite with a tune in Ableton first. He recorded some live trumpet & chose drum sounds / beats etc. I was doing the clicking.

Not wanting to leave my 6 year old girl out, I said I'd do a song with her in Ableton too.

I had no choice but to finish / arrange their tracks , so that they could listen to them afterwards. Otherwise, what was the point?

I wasn't gonna get any more ideas or material from them, I had to get something going on their behalf. And quick. So I did.

Few days later, my son to made a loop in Soundtrap. His first assignment.

He was recording bits of white noise from his Korg Monotribe over some multi-sampled instruments. I was leaving him to it.. telling him to put a crash w.fx on bar 32 etc.. he did a great job. I helped stretch it all out to 4mins so he would have something to listen to. Built it up.. had different sections.. the usual: Variation to maintain interest.

What did I learn?

I enjoy chasing sounds & working out puzzles. Creative stuff. I'm not good at the next phase: the organisation part / making the arrangement. By not directly being part of the creative process myself.. & separating myself from what the kids created, I was able to arrange & organise the material we'd made. Interesting.

This doesn't surprise me. I've read about this long ago , but like anything else in life; sometimes you need to learn your own lessons.

I'm very eager now to go back through some of the millions of old projects I have & see what I can do. I pretty much get sick of something when it sounds shit.. or I have no real musical idea. There were clear ideas with the kids tracks. I was forced to knuckle down too. I'm probably guilty of expecting an Eureka moment when I'm messing about & getting frustrated when it doesn't happen i.e: I start arranging. This usually results in moving on.. or I'll be naturally inspired by something else & begin working on something new. That's my usual cycle.

Just thought I'd mention all this it as it's something that's of eternal interest to a lot of us. For me, I think a penny has dropped 🤔😎
KennethExack wrote:My kids and I are completely shocked by the specialized secrets that everyone has on this forum
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Evert
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Re: Arrangement Warz

Post by Evert »

Have you showed them how to make that reverb rumble yet?

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Críoch
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Re: Arrangement Warz

Post by Críoch »

Hahaha.

That's paid content - they're on the free samples ATM 👍
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Re: Arrangement Warz

Post by Fourty Two »

Yeah, i know exactly what you're referring to.
As I enjoy making beats and themes as next person, watching KSHMR speaking about this same thing made me realize I'm guilty of pressing "new project button" more often then finishing tunes.
His approach was to convince brain that this is fun as well.
I really enjoy talks by some random artists that have some years of production under their belts, not just necessary techno music. If there's like like good advice or story, I'm down.
Tbh I reckon he was stoned out of his mind on that talk 😀

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Re: Arrangement Warz

Post by Críoch »

Personally, trying to see it as fun (initially).. just doesn't seem to work for me. Has not worked in the past. I'm fucked 😭😄

I think if I can detatch myself from the loop / material generation stage.. then I'd probably get some self- satisfaction from getting to an end of some kind. At some point.

That, would be fun. Maybe afterwards.. the next time wouldn't be as big of a deal. Wouldn't even have to arrange every loop.. only what I felt was good enough. I don't like this 'finish everything' approach. Sometimes stuff is only practice. And it stinks. Fact 🙃
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Re: Arrangement Warz

Post by borg »

In March/April I 'finished' 16 tracks in 31 days... The idea came after a phone call with a friend: a track a day during a period that has a whole story I've been meaning to tell, but that story kept on evolving, and I haven't really found an opportunity yet. I also realized I may be a daily reader, but hadn't posted in a while, which made it weird. And it's about women and relationships, and ... And where to start? How far back in time?

About 20 years ago, I had this stunning girlfriend with a big heart. Was still an old boy and she a young woman, so didn't last long. After a first somewhat longer relationship of six years with a passionate but slightly crazy (good and bad) female person, I met the lovely woman that I lost to cancer just over two years ago. Now music had become since my mid twenties something I would do at night, as a hobby, at home, just noodling, especially since working as an engineer in a high profile theatre with only top of the shelf artists on your stage, real musicians, most of them barely making ends meet. Anyway, my wife was very supportive, and was always asking when I was gonna play live again (remember, stopped doing that long ago). It's one of those things I regret not doing for her. If anything good came from her death, it was me starting to make music like never before. I made it a mission to realize something with my music, whatever.
So for over a year, I kept starting project after project. Kicks this, kicks there, gain staging, distortion tralala, getting a smaller set of tools, refining things, but still noodling on. Always thinking too much about the live set, without having finished a decent track, ever. Last summer I had my first concert in 17 years, very small scale, but a concert nonetheless! What had to be a live techno set, got turned around completely into a live guitar ambient loop fest. The day after the concert I packed up everything cause I wanted to start the big conversion of the house, keeping just a corner of the dining room for my laptop and a few controllers. Still noodling and making loops with my headphones. Work got really busy, the house didn't progress, not too much music, sometimes I would get physically uncomfortable from wanting to feel a woman's skin again. Now, a good wank usually sorts that.
As mourning goes in stages, I felt it was time for a change. It was beginning of December. Picked up things in the house, addressed some bad habits, forced myself to go see some concerts,... Yep, got things going again, and then, at the cash desk of a supermarket I usually don't go to was that girlfriend of 20 years ago, still a stunning woman and gentle as ever. We had a long and jolly chat, but also sad stories to tell, a widower and a divorced, single mom of a ten year old cool skater. Changed numbers, some messages were sent, meeting was difficult with the holiday season, and January was my busiest month ever. We then started calling each other frequently and finally pinned a date in February, and it was getting clear it wasn't just for sipping tea... But then she got ill, went to the doctor, we settled for another day, but a few days before our date, she called to say we shouldn't meet... Her doctor had her examined and she was diagnosed with breast cancer, metastasis to liver and bones... We had a very long talk, and said goodbye, hoping for the best, and a walk and a drink in the summer.
I was quite devastated, couldn't sleep for two days, felt miserable. And then Covid-19 started to take over the North of Italy, and still felt miseralbe, so I went to the doctor, and he wanted me to get an X-ray. Next day he called me to say he was quite worried and had already arranged a meeting with a specialist. Bronchoscopy, additional scans, and then the verdict... They weren't sure, but they feared lung cancer. I had lost 10 kgs. over the period of a year, 25 years of smoking, lots of signs pointing in that direction. So there I was, 47, lost my wife, half of my house is under construction, temporarily on the dole (starting again this Wednesday), lost a new love to cancer even before it started, and now facing one of the deadliest of them all, and completely on my own in my little bulb. I was scheduled to have a biopsy mid March, and at this point in time, we had gone into lockdown. Very weird time that was.
So why the story? Ha! I had a long phone call with my best friend, "hey, maybe got lung cancer"... Anyway, she said "make a song a day". And so I did, or tried... One song a day is just not feasible. It was more 2 tracks every 3 days, mostly get something going in a few hours, finish up the next day in the afternoon, and in the evening start a new track, and so on... But there was still the biopsy to come.
The morning of the biopsy, I woke up shivering like it was a Siberian winter, 39°C fever, vomiting,... Called the doctor, and two hours later I was at the corona emergency entrance welcomed by a whole team of medics as if I were from Mars, and I spent that night in the covid-19 hall way. They woke me up next morning with the good news my tests were negative, and that the new X-ray showed the suspicious spot that got the doctors so worried had grown considerably since the first X-ray, which meant it was no tumor/cancer. Got antibiotics, new tests showed great results, and now end verdict is pneumonia, an abscess... In the mean time started working in the house again, little by little, as I was never really sick, but I feel I have weakened considerably.

To get back on topic... So I ended up, in this super weird period of time, with 16 tracks, almost 2 hours of music, and some of them are of my best ones ever. And this is even without all the guitar based songs I wrote, but yet have to record. None of these are release worthy, but some are as close as I've ever been, some are, well, nice efforts, at times I've amazed myself.
I can hardly remember anything from what I did a month ago, and the idea is to have a good listen, make notes on what to add, or most likely strip, and hopefully finish up in two more sessions per track. Probably gonna pick 8 tracks for 2 EPs, one techno, one more Warp stuff oriented. Try and make something of a bandcamp page, donate the 16 Euros they make to a good cause...
Conclusion: I finished more tracks in one month than in the previous ten years, because I didn't have time to endlessly tweak kicks and a 101 plugin, I used various techniques I hadn't really used before, I have considerably improved over the years since Subsekt happened to me, and also in this intensive month, even my best mates don't give a fuck 'bout my music, ha! None but one have responded to my request for notes. I have a lot of affinity with the Dude, and at times may even look a lot like him, but I must also sympathize with Marty here
youtu.be/XmRudyg48Ho

If anyone's interested, send me a PM, and I'll provide a dropbox link :lol:

In the meantime... Although we agreed that all her energy and attention should go to her son and family, she sent a message last week, saying the chemo is catching on surprisingly well, however, it's still not a bright future, but she still hopes to meet in summer... I hope we can do some music together. She's a fantastic singer. I remember NYE 2000-2001... We had just gotten out of a party on a barge, early in the morning. It was snowing, and there she stood, under a lamp post in her finest dress and fake fur coat with the flakes dancing in the light, then she started singing an Ella Fitzgerald song and I melted. She was very shy about it and hadn't told me, but she had a very dark and sexy voice, and spot on! I have already a house EP nearly finished waiting for some vocals. We'll see...
Andy
the lunatics are in the hall...

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Re: Arrangement Warz

Post by over9000 »

This is 2020 everything changes rapidly fast.
Hope it turns out well for you mate!
I got a new job in february, lost my driving license, lost the job, worked here and there like i used too, maybe have a new job in july.
Shit is really crazy atm,, i know a few people that experience weird shit like you andy
This year is like a rollercoaster, it can be a big chance for change i think. People start to really change their ways

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Re: Arrangement Warz

Post by Críoch »

Sorry Andy, I was pretty busy yesterday & didn't get enough time to sit down & reply decently to you.

Well.. very happy to hear about you finishing the tracks, but it's a shame to read the circumstances of catalyst. Sorry again about your wife Man. It's too young. We are too young for all this to be happening, surely? Or maybe we are older or more mortal than we think? But what an ass-kicker bumping into your ex like that & then finding out her subsequent news. Hope ye get together after all of this. It's good that you still have a connection.

But fucking hell.. like , just when maybe you are getting used to your head navigating around one corner, you suddenly become aware of an equally unexpected & unwanted obstacle. Man, it must be so fucking hard not to draw parallels.. and then with yourself too. You need a strong head mate to keep going & also to keep yourself busy. You have plenty to show for yourself in both regards.. & I respect that about you 👍😎😎😎.

Keep pushing through. It's all we can do. I think we've all had a few health bumps by the 40 mark. I decided to make some changes around my early 30s.. and continued on the last 10years or so. I became aware of how things could end up ( clock is ticking) & really focused on the work / life balance / maintaining best health. I made things happen. Moved house. Went back to college. Changed careers. Probably should have made some oaths regarding finishing tracks 🤣.. but I chose to change my priorities when I became a dad. Meeting new people & subsekt randomly occured somewhere in the middle :lol: . Anyway, warning shots, if that's all they are & as long as they keep missing ( or causing minimal damage - let's be honest 🤕); can be useful.

Have you stopped smoking then?

I'd a C19 test as part of work screening. Negative. Man.. it was horrible. Nothing compared to your experience though lol.. but yeah, it was like being a specimen in a bug jar. The eyes. Im wearing a mask in work 24/7. I've never done as much winking or up-thumbing to compensate for a lack of facial cues.
borg wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 3:21 am
In March/April I 'finished' 16 tracks in 31 days... The idea came after a phone call with a friend: a track a day during a period that has a whole story I've been meaning to tell, but that story kept on evolving, and I haven't really found an opportunity yet. I also realized I may be a daily reader, but hadn't posted in a while, which made it weird. And it's about women and relationships, and ... And where to start? How far back in time?

About 20 years ago, I had this stunning girlfriend with a big heart. Was still an old boy and she a young woman, so didn't last long. After a first somewhat longer relationship of six years with a passionate but slightly crazy (good and bad) female person, I met the lovely woman that I lost to cancer just over two years ago. Now music had become since my mid twenties something I would do at night, as a hobby, at home, just noodling, especially since working as an engineer in a high profile theatre with only top of the shelf artists on your stage, real musicians, most of them barely making ends meet. Anyway, my wife was very supportive, and was always asking when I was gonna play live again (remember, stopped doing that long ago). It's one of those things I regret not doing for her. If anything good came from her death, it was me starting to make music like never before. I made it a mission to realize something with my music, whatever.
So for over a year, I kept starting project after project. Kicks this, kicks there, gain staging, distortion tralala, getting a smaller set of tools, refining things, but still noodling on. Always thinking too much about the live set, without having finished a decent track, ever. Last summer I had my first concert in 17 years, very small scale, but a concert nonetheless! What had to be a live techno set, got turned around completely into a live guitar ambient loop fest. The day after the concert I packed up everything cause I wanted to start the big conversion of the house, keeping just a corner of the dining room for my laptop and a few controllers. Still noodling and making loops with my headphones. Work got really busy, the house didn't progress, not too much music, sometimes I would get physically uncomfortable from wanting to feel a woman's skin again. Now, a good wank usually sorts that.
As mourning goes in stages, I felt it was time for a change. It was beginning of December. Picked up things in the house, addressed some bad habits, forced myself to go see some concerts,... Yep, got things going again, and then, at the cash desk of a supermarket I usually don't go to was that girlfriend of 20 years ago, still a stunning woman and gentle as ever. We had a long and jolly chat, but also sad stories to tell, a widower and a divorced, single mom of a ten year old cool skater. Changed numbers, some messages were sent, meeting was difficult with the holiday season, and January was my busiest month ever. We then started calling each other frequently and finally pinned a date in February, and it was getting clear it wasn't just for sipping tea... But then she got ill, went to the doctor, we settled for another day, but a few days before our date, she called to say we shouldn't meet... Her doctor had her examined and she was diagnosed with breast cancer, metastasis to liver and bones... We had a very long talk, and said goodbye, hoping for the best, and a walk and a drink in the summer.
I was quite devastated, couldn't sleep for two days, felt miserable. And then Covid-19 started to take over the North of Italy, and still felt miseralbe, so I went to the doctor, and he wanted me to get an X-ray. Next day he called me to say he was quite worried and had already arranged a meeting with a specialist. Bronchoscopy, additional scans, and then the verdict... They weren't sure, but they feared lung cancer. I had lost 10 kgs. over the period of a year, 25 years of smoking, lots of signs pointing in that direction. So there I was, 47, lost my wife, half of my house is under construction, temporarily on the dole (starting again this Wednesday), lost a new love to cancer even before it started, and now facing one of the deadliest of them all, and completely on my own in my little bulb. I was scheduled to have a biopsy mid March, and at this point in time, we had gone into lockdown. Very weird time that was.
So why the story? Ha! I had a long phone call with my best friend, "hey, maybe got lung cancer"... Anyway, she said "make a song a day". And so I did, or tried... One song a day is just not feasible. It was more 2 tracks every 3 days, mostly get something going in a few hours, finish up the next day in the afternoon, and in the evening start a new track, and so on... But there was still the biopsy to come.
The morning of the biopsy, I woke up shivering like it was a Siberian winter, 39°C fever, vomiting,... Called the doctor, and two hours later I was at the corona emergency entrance welcomed by a whole team of medics as if I were from Mars, and I spent that night in the covid-19 hall way. They woke me up next morning with the good news my tests were negative, and that the new X-ray showed the suspicious spot that got the doctors so worried had grown considerably since the first X-ray, which meant it was no tumor/cancer. Got antibiotics, new tests showed great results, and now end verdict is pneumonia, an abscess... In the mean time started working in the house again, little by little, as I was never really sick, but I feel I have weakened considerably.

To get back on topic... So I ended up, in this super weird period of time, with 16 tracks, almost 2 hours of music, and some of them are of my best ones ever. And this is even without all the guitar based songs I wrote, but yet have to record. None of these are release worthy, but some are as close as I've ever been, some are, well, nice efforts, at times I've amazed myself.
I can hardly remember anything from what I did a month ago, and the idea is to have a good listen, make notes on what to add, or most likely strip, and hopefully finish up in two more sessions per track. Probably gonna pick 8 tracks for 2 EPs, one techno, one more Warp stuff oriented. Try and make something of a bandcamp page, donate the 16 Euros they make to a good cause...
Conclusion: I finished more tracks in one month than in the previous ten years, because I didn't have time to endlessly tweak kicks and a 101 plugin, I used various techniques I hadn't really used before, I have considerably improved over the years since Subsekt happened to me, and also in this intensive month, even my best mates don't give a fuck 'bout my music, ha! None but one have responded to my request for notes. I have a lot of affinity with the Dude, and at times may even look a lot like him, but I must also sympathize with Marty here
youtu.be/XmRudyg48Ho

If anyone's interested, send me a PM, and I'll provide a dropbox link :lol:

In the meantime... Although we agreed that all her energy and attention should go to her son and family, she sent a message last week, saying the chemo is catching on surprisingly well, however, it's still not a bright future, but she still hopes to meet in summer... I hope we can do some music together. She's a fantastic singer. I remember NYE 2000-2001... We had just gotten out of a party on a barge, early in the morning. It was snowing, and there she stood, under a lamp post in her finest dress and fake fur coat with the flakes dancing in the light, then she started singing an Ella Fitzgerald song and I melted. She was very shy about it and hadn't told me, but she had a very dark and sexy voice, and spot on! I have already a house EP nearly finished waiting for some vocals. We'll see...
KennethExack wrote:My kids and I are completely shocked by the specialized secrets that everyone has on this forum
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borg
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Re: Arrangement Warz

Post by borg »

Nah, why sorry? I wan't subconsciously sending signals for help, I think? :lol:
Bitter as it all may sound, I'm quite ok! It's not grand, of course! I appreciate being still around and all, and I've always been kinda laid back in everything I do, just like the Dude... But thanks!!!

Smoking... I had stopped a few days before the planned biopsy. I had already considerably cut back from the day the doc said something was wrong, just 2, 3 small sticks a day. Anyway, the oncologist advised against stopping at once, as it would put the body in a kind of shock and would effect test results, and would give me more stress. On top of that, two weeks later when cancer was off the table and some more lab results came in, the doc said my lungs are in surprisingly good shape for 25 years of smoking. Those are not good things to say to an addict, who was ready to stop. I still smoke a lot less, about 1/3th of what I smoked before, and only with pot.
Today I started working again, so that was a big test. Didn't smoke all day, until I got home at about seven. Plan is to cut back to smoke only evenings before a day off. But look, my wife was a fanatic sporter in her youth and hiker later on, never smoked, did drugs, always healthy food on the table... Just unlucky...

Kids... That changes everything, doesn't it? How life would have been different should I have children! Funny, when we was young, I was about the only one considering a family, while most of my mates were against having kids. That has turned out completely the other way around. Love kids though! But it's like a pet, it's nice to play with someone else's once in a while. Was a stepdad for about five years, two teenagers, but lovely and smart kids, they never gave me trouble. Unlike the cat. She started to really annoy me, I think it isn't doing my health any good, with the hairs flying around at times, but I don't have the heart to bring her to an animal shelter. If I knew she would get a nice new home.

Did they pierce that swab thing without any warning up your nose as well? Didn't see that coming! That was painful...

Not as painful as finishing a track, cause that's what it is all about, no? Wasn't it Hades who told the story of the pottery class? One half had to finish as much vases as possible in a semester, the other half just had to try and make the most beautiful one they could... It's a part of making music that needs training as well. And a change of attitude. Don't we all love those words "the process", "committing",...
I've been really gassing over this Ibanez Soundgear 5-string bass. I think I need it...
Andy
the lunatics are in the hall...

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Re: Arrangement Warz

Post by subvers^v »

Nice reading this.

I've gone thru a tough phase in last couple of years dealing with my own shit and what I have learned is that things tend work themselves out when given time., although not necessarily how you expect them to. I would also think there's more to that random meeting (fuck, that sounds a bit horoscopey, haha!) but timing is a strange thing...

My gf is currently going thru chemo for breast cancer, a year after our first was born and two years after my stint in a treatment centre. Throw the whole covid buzz in there too, why not?!! It's been tough going in ways but I've found out how tough she really is and so far so good.

I suppose the main thing I wanted to say is how it took me a strong dose of reality to get really motivated. It applied more for general life shit but it's obvious reading this that making music is right up there for you. It's kinda up there for me too...but I'm ok with just playing about with things.

I think you should def treat yerself to that bass though! ..

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Re: Arrangement Warz

Post by subvers^v »

And yeah, I remember that Hades story; quality over quantity is not always the best approach. I did woodworking for a while and was somewhat late to the game. Others had been doing it for years so I was "slow". My tutor at the time said "Work faster and you'll get the fuck ups out of the way sooner!" There's an element of truth to that...

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Re: Arrangement Warz

Post by borg »

subvers^v wrote:
Mon Jun 01, 2020 11:14 pm
I suppose the main thing I wanted to say is how it took me a strong dose of reality to get really motivated. It applied more for general life shit but it's obvious reading this that making music is right up there for you. It's kinda up there for me too...but I'm ok with just playing about with things.

I think you should def treat yerself to that bass though! ..
good to read you got things going somehow and the family is doing gf is doing ok, hope the kid is too! We didn't have children, and at first, I thought it was a blessing, but apparently the opposite is true. Keeps you in touch with reality. Anyway, we are resilient vermin... There aren't a lot options, are there? End it all (crossed my mind, never considered it though, not the type), get stuck in a loop, or move on... It just stinks that just at the moment things are picking up again...
Ah well, I'm doing fine, there isn't a lot that gets me worked up, life can be beautiful, and I appreciate the little things, and music like never before, started working part time . It's just a bummer we as a circle of friends are of the conscious type, so no getting together, and most aren't into the social media stuff, so it's a bit quite.
Started working again, so that was nice, although a bit scary as a risk patient, as apart from washing hands, nobody is really that cautious (just a few colleagues are wearing masks, tools change hands continuously, distancing is not always possible, but also not always respected...). Ah, another four weeks, and I have seven weeks off again.

I dusted off the Machinedrum and we seem to get along much better than before! Studying the AE patches was kind of an eye opener. The bass will have to wait...
Andy
the lunatics are in the hall...

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subvers^v
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Re: Arrangement Warz

Post by subvers^v »

It's true, my gf reckons if our little one wasn't in the picture it would be a very different story. We've been told that it's pretty much it in terms of having more kids as her type of cancer is linked to oestrogen levels and another pregnancy would be very risky.

There's been a lot of acceptance along the way...but it's ok. You just have to count yer blessings.

Those Ae patches sound interesting. Have an md and mpc500 that haven't seen daylight in a very long time. Might trick about with this too. See links on elektronauts.

Enjoy the job and mind yerself ..


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