Difference in sound between monitors and headphones

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ZenoSupreme
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Difference in sound between monitors and headphones

Post by ZenoSupreme »

Hi guys,

I stumbled across something very strange.

I'm making a beat and through the monitors the sound is just fine, but when i hear it through my headphones one instrument sounds very different. It's like it has meen deformed and stripped of it's body. All other productions sound just fine, and all other instruments in this production also sound fine.

Do you guys also encounter this problem from time to time, and if so, what do you trust, your headphone or the monitors? Is there anything I can do to prevent this?

I have yamaha HS7 monitors and yamaha HPH-MT8 headphones...

Greetz!

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Re: Difference in sound between monitors and headphones

Post by Evert »

I'll leave the technical details to the pro's, but I would say the problem is caused by your room acoustics.
Treating your room would be the solution in that case. There's a big thread dedicated to room treatment on here called "Room treatment: where to start?" or something along those lines.

I never trust one system, because I work in an untreated room and I know headphones have their own problems. It's best to try out your music on different systems.
Maybe you can post a clip to see how it translates on other member's systems?

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Re: Difference in sound between monitors and headphones

Post by Lost to the Void »

The simple answer is that your monitors and headphones have a different frequency response to each other.
The MT8 headphones are not "great" studio headphones, they dip out at 300hz losing some weight from the body of music.

If you are going to use monitors and headphones, then you want similar performance from them, or as close to flat as possible. And then learn them both well.

I would trust HS7`s over MT8`s for sure (providing there are no room issues).
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Re: Difference in sound between monitors and headphones

Post by P0607r0n »

Lost to the Void wrote: I would trust HS7`s over MT8`s for sure (providing there are no room issues).
Mhm, going with that lead, which headphones would you trust over the hs7's?
At the moment I'm running the studio on hs80m, but the room acoustics are far from being great (it's hard to commit to that in my living situation) so i started to look for the studio headphones.

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Re: Difference in sound between monitors and headphones

Post by RWise »

P0607r0n wrote:
Lost to the Void wrote: I would trust HS7`s over MT8`s for sure (providing there are no room issues).
Mhm, going with that lead, which headphones would you trust over the hs7's?
At the moment I'm running the studio on hs80m, but the room acoustics are far from being great (it's hard to commit to that in my living situation) so i started to look for the studio headphones.
If youre on a budget, some of the best bang for buck studio headphones are the Beyerdynamic DT-770 and Audio technica m50x.

Now of course theyre not perfect but for the money they are really good and so much of it comes from knowing how your monitoring resources sound. If you cant make a good mix on them headphones then more expensive ones wont do you much more justice in my opinion.
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Re: Difference in sound between monitors and headphones

Post by Lost to the Void »

P0607r0n wrote:
Lost to the Void wrote: I would trust HS7`s over MT8`s for sure (providing there are no room issues).
Mhm, going with that lead, which headphones would you trust over the hs7's?
At the moment I'm running the studio on hs80m, but the room acoustics are far from being great (it's hard to commit to that in my living situation) so i started to look for the studio headphones.
hs80m is a great monitor for the price.

Well, I`ve talked about this loads on this forum.
I love making music on headphones, as I love to be utterly buried in the sound, which you simply can`t do with nearfield monitors.
So even though I have fantastic nearfields, (DT-SM55`s) in the production room, and Shitballs beautiful Speakers in the mastering room (Goldenear Triton 1`s), I still prefer making music on phones.
As an audio fidelity obsessive I`m super fussy about cans, and when I decided to get myself a new set of phones last year I dove in deep and tested all sorts of stuff.

Under £200 (and to be honest, up to around 800 quid) the absolute best headphones for translation I tested (and I tested a shit load) and bought were the AKG 701`s (702`s are the same but with detachable cable). You really can`t go wrong with a set of them, they are dead flat, they do not lie, I can mix on them and they will translate to the systems in both my rooms very well. I have shit pressed on vinyl that was mostly mixed on them.
In fact I have a pair in my mastering room which I use when doing very detailed double checking on low end distortion.

You can get them new for around £120 quid, at that price, with that level of fidelity it`s a no-brainer, don`t touch audiotechica, they are terrible, they have humps and dips all over the place.

Some caveats

You will benefit from getting a headphone amp to drive them nicely.
They are open, so they can be heard when doing night work, by other people in the room.


If you want to go exotic I recommend Etymotic ER4-XR, these are in ear monitors, and more expensive but they are so spot on it`s crazy.
I actually use these now most of the time rather then the K701`s as they are a little more accurate, but in-ears are not for everyone.......


I am not sponsored by either of these companies by the way...
Headphones and speakers are just an obsession of mine.
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Re: Difference in sound between monitors and headphones

Post by ZenoSupreme »

Tnx for the quick replies!

At the moment I have major room accoustics issues. My gear is at a friend place, cuz my girl and I moved to a place where I can't set it up right now. His room actually sucks and the placement of the monitors is even worse... But I can't do a thing about it for the time being, I will have to wait till I get studio space.

I will also try to listen to it on different systems, see whats up and if the sound modification persists. I'll also try to upload a sample of the sound as soon as possible.


@Void: I am considering to buy the 702's for quite a while now and I probably will soon. I was wondering if I also need a amp if I stick it in my allen & heath zed 10 mixer? and if so, whitch one would you recomend?

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Re: Difference in sound between monitors and headphones

Post by Críoch »

Hi Steve.. those headphones are k701's are they? Or are there different versions?

Seem to be around 150€ on Thomann.
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Re: Difference in sound between monitors and headphones

Post by Plyphon »

As Steve said K701 and K702 are the same headphone, 702 has a detachable cable.

I'm not sure they still make the 701.

https://www.thomann.de/gb/akg_k702.htm

Cheaper on Amazon in the UK

https://www.amazon.co.uk/AKG-Reference- ... s=AKG+k702

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Re: Difference in sound between monitors and headphones

Post by Lost to the Void »

Críoch wrote:Hi Steve.. those headphones are k701's are they? Or are there different versions?

Seem to be around 150€ on Thomann.
Yeah K701 (actually exactly the same as the Quincy Jones licensed Q701, but half the price) or K702, same cans but 702 has detatchable cord.
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Re: Difference in sound between monitors and headphones

Post by Lost to the Void »

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Re: Difference in sound between monitors and headphones

Post by Belka »

Isnt the biggest differenz that Speaker are real Stereo with a Crossover of the left and right Monitor while Headphones just a Dual Mono (i think its the wrong term because dual mono indicates 2 unrelated signals i guess). Which is the reason why i absolutly cant Produce the bottoms of my tracks on Headphone because bright Stereo Kicks and Subs sounds totally awesome and full on headphones but lack everything on monitors, no power, no rumble and thin af? Thats my observation (no scientific background atm, its more a question than a statement)


P.S. got Fostex PM1 6,5" Monitors and Shure SRH 840 cans

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Re: Difference in sound between monitors and headphones

Post by Lost to the Void »

Not really, stereo separation is a bit of an issue, but it's not the main one.

You can deal with stereo separation issues for headphones with plugins that create bleed and phantom centre.

Such as

https://www.112db.com/redline/monitor/

https://www.toneboosters.com/tb_bustools_v3.html. (Isone Pro is part of a bundle)

Also toneboosters bundles are going super cheap. No brained purchases right there.
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Re: Difference in sound between monitors and headphones

Post by Críoch »

Cheers Steve.

I've got a pair of sennheiser hd25ii. I enjoy how they sound, but for the best will in the world, its like putting your head in a vicegrip. I only use them for a quick detail check.. but even that's too long sometimes. They're either too compact or my head is too big :)

Was thinking of getting something new so will add them to ze list.
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Re: Difference in sound between monitors and headphones

Post by Lost to the Void »

YEah, you`ll be better off, those sennheisers are bass heavy.
The AKG`s are also very very comfy, they are circumaural.
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Re: Difference in sound between monitors and headphones

Post by RWise »

Always buy detachable cable headphones as well if you can. Regardless of what you get.
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Re: Difference in sound between monitors and headphones

Post by CRDM »

Críoch wrote:Cheers Steve.

I've got a pair of sennheiser hd25ii. I enjoy how they sound, but for the best will in the world, its like putting your head in a vicegrip. I only use them for a quick detail check.. but even that's too long sometimes. They're either too compact or my head is too big :)

Was thinking of getting something new so will add them to ze list.
I've owned the sennheiser for DJing for quite a few years and have the AKG 702 are completely different. Way, way comfier and as Void said they are great to mix with! You wouldn't regret that purchase, I got them through recommendation here about a year ago and been happy with the translation.

Speaking of the phantom centre plugins (not tried the redline one you mentioned void), I've been demoing Goodhertz canopener which
is working really well, much prefer the imaging through the plugin.

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Re: Difference in sound between monitors and headphones

Post by Planar »

Yeah, the hd25ii's aren't meant for referencing, they're for monitoring. I love my 25ii pro's for DJing with, but there is no way in hell I'd use them for anything else, they're uncomfortable and really bass heavy.

I barely use my monitors these days. My 880's and redline monitor are good enough for 90% of the job and my subpac covers the physical aspect of things when I need it. A quick listen or 2 on my monitors for confirmation at the very end is all I tend to do now.


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