How do you guys use U-He Satin?

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How do you guys use U-He Satin?

Post by dubdub »

For all the virtual tape lovers here...

I used to basically use the same NAB preset for ages but recently I've been trying some different settings. I think it's really interesting that you can from super subtle to totally re-shaping the mix. I'm definitely frequently guilty of the latter :) NAB really makes those kicks boom and IES and AES can really brighten up a dull mix. I can never decide between the two :) I might be going to far sometimes though, real tape obviously is more subtle. I think Steve mentioned that he managed to emulate his old tape machine in Satin? I've been googling if anyone else emulated some other classic tape machines but haven't really found any juicy presets. I have no experience with real tape so some of the parameters are a bit arcane to me. The presets in Satin are a bit lacking, I like the Studer A827 though.

So for anyone here who uses Satin, do you have a favorite preset you always go to or do you go from scratch for every project? Do you stay realistic or do you go crazy? Do you ever use the Vintage mode? It always sounds a bit too grime-y for me, even though I usually love everything murky and lo-fi.

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Re: How do you guys use U-He Satin?

Post by MeTeK »

Not really sure about how to use it because like you said, i don't know this "tape song".
But i like to put it sometimes on my main kick.

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Re: How do you guys use U-He Satin?

Post by Belka »

dont want to open a new thread but its a similiar topic. the Kramer Master Tape is on sale for hilarious 30 bucks, iam totally not inside tape saturation for now and i think it would be a good start. Whats your thoughts on this?

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Re: How do you guys use U-He Satin?

Post by Lost to the Void »

Kramer tape is crap.
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Re: How do you guys use U-He Satin?

Post by Mattias »

Kramer Tape is an abomination.
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Re: How do you guys use U-He Satin?

Post by dubdub »

:lol:

What exactly makes it so crap?

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Re: How do you guys use U-He Satin?

Post by Lost to the Void »

It doesn`t emulate tape machines very well, accept for the graphics and the reels going round, so IF you buy it based on that illusion, it is shit.
IF you take it for what it is, a sort of previous generation vst saturation, then it is passable.
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Re: How do you guys use U-He Satin?

Post by Senko »

Little off-topic. How does Satin stack up against to say a Neve 542 or an okay reel-to-reel? Rather, is it worth dropping $ on these machines when something in VST land can get you 80% there.

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Re: How do you guys use U-He Satin?

Post by Lost to the Void »

I have a reel to reel, I went through a phase about 10 years ago, buying refurbishing and selling reel to reel machines.
How does Satin stack up against a Never 542, no idea, but I pretty damn accurately recreated the sound of both an A80, and my own Revox G36, itself a rare all valve machine with about the most mojo you can get from a tape machine.

Is it worth dropping money on a tape machine.
That depends how badly you want one.
They are expensive, heavy and take up a lot of room.
Tape is relatively hard to source and expensive.
Old tape machines need a fair amount of maintenance, so it helps if you are mechanically and electrically savvy as there is a lot that can go wrong.
Servicing is very expensive, just in postage costs alone. You are looking at losing the best part of 300 quid for a service.
It also helps to know a bit about Machines or you could end up buying a shit box full of problems that will bite you on the ass.

Satin does a pretty good job of emulating a lot of characteristics of various machines. As you can dig in and fuck with stuff that you can't fuck with on most machines, and you can also emulate broken\worn machines. So you would need a few machines to get the range of satin.

It doesn't, of course, emulate different tapes, or old fucked tapes where the coating is cracking up, or tapes that have been erased loads of times. So it doesn't do everything, but it does enough that my old machine sits in storage.

Tape machines are nice things to have as objects. The clunkyness of them is endearing, the glow of the VUs and the head light, the whirring tapes etc.

Only you can decide if they are worth the money.

In the end, for me, they are a fuck load of hassle and finding a viable digital alternative with all the convenience that comes with it, was a godsend.
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Re: How do you guys use U-He Satin?

Post by arkos »

Even more off topic, is no one here digging Softube Tape?? It's got very few controls but I'm loving it on everything, the transient smoothing this thing does is magical.

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Re: How do you guys use U-He Satin?

Post by Senko »

Lost to the Void wrote:
In the end, for me, they are a fuck load of hassle and finding a viable digital alternative with all the convenience that comes with it, was a godsend.
That seals the deal. I sold my Revox A77 before I even had a chance to use it. Granted the thing was pretty beat... but I didn't have the necessary knowledge to service it, and I would've had to ship it out to bob's repair shop with only hopes and prayers of getting a proper machine back (And at about a $250-$400 cost quote). This is when I started looking at that Neve piece, but couldn't find any proper audio examples.

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Re: How do you guys use U-He Satin?

Post by Senko »

arkos wrote:Even more off topic, is no one here digging Softube Tape?? It's got very few controls but I'm loving it on everything, the transient smoothing this thing does is magical.
Meant to look for a post about that on here. Would you recommend it?

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Re: How do you guys use U-He Satin?

Post by Lost to the Void »

arkos wrote:Even more off topic, is no one here digging Softube Tape?? It's got very few controls but I'm loving it on everything, the transient smoothing this thing does is magical.

meh, again, it`s.....ok.

I bought tape machines back as mentioned because it was a sound I was missing that just wasn`t captured in the digital realm, the saturation aspect is easy to capture but the dynamic action, the way the knee changes as you drive +0dbv the way the transients change like a mu compressor, but more quickly, and yet more smoothly...

Basically until Satin came along there was nothing stopping me from using my machine, I was skeptical as every single tape emulation had failed to capture all aspects of how tape actually sounds.....

Softubes thing is ok, better than some, no better than bootsies (free) ferric, or TB Reelbus (v3), but it still doesn`t feel "real".

There was a long thread on the forum about this a way back.
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Re: How do you guys use U-He Satin?

Post by arkos »

Lost to the Void wrote:
Softubes thing is ok, better than some, no better than bootsies (free) ferric, or TB Reelbus (v3), but it still doesn`t feel "real".

There was a long thread on the forum about this a way back.
I'm no tape expert although I've edited plenty to tape in the past and to me that TB Reelbus sounds like a dying animals last howl :mrgreen:

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Re: How do you guys use U-He Satin?

Post by Lost to the Void »

arkos wrote:
Lost to the Void wrote:
Softubes thing is ok, better than some, no better than bootsies (free) ferric, or TB Reelbus (v3), but it still doesn`t feel "real".

There was a long thread on the forum about this a way back.
I'm no tape expert although I've edited plenty to tape in the past and to me that TB Reelbus sounds like a dying animals last howl :mrgreen:

Come now, hyperbole..... It works very well, it`s dynamic action is pretty good, the bias and pre-emphasis in particular, are pretty good.... in "real" tape terms, it works pretty subtly.



I think part of the problem is that people expect tape plugins to be more..... obvious... in what they do, as they hear that tape is this magical mojo.

Tape is pretty subtle, but it can in some circumstances be the things that edges a mix to "spot on". In the same way a compressor can or a certain amp stage.
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Re: How do you guys use U-He Satin?

Post by msl »

It's been living on my master bus since the day I bought it, always on, usually clean settings 30ips, sometimes I'll set it to vintage and 15ips. I always push the input so I'm just going in into the red a little.

I love it as a delay and flanger but its so damn cpu intensive in that role that I can only really use 1 instance in an already busy track, so I tend to use it rarely, need to use it more for flanger.


Played with Kramer Tape when it came out, I liked it on bass, a lot, but not on the mix at all. Satin rules on the mix bus imo.
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Re: How do you guys use U-He Satin?

Post by arkos »

Lost to the Void wrote:
Tape is pretty subtle, but it can in some circumstances be the things that edges a mix to "spot on". In the same way a compressor can or a certain amp stage.

That's exactly my experience with Softube's Tape, put some of my badly mixed "home mastered" loops through it and they actually sounded better, transients not as harsh, each track had more space in the mix and the loops sounded a lot more cohesive as a whole.

I know I'm a total Softube whore but what can I do, I'm in love with the sound of their plugins... :mrgreen:

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Re: How do you guys use U-He Satin?

Post by Lost to the Void »

arkos wrote:

each track had more space in the mix
Those are the words of subjective expectation bias.

No tape machine, or tape plugin, or in fact any dynamic action audio process will add more space to a mix, except maybe an expander, which a accurate tape emulation is certainly not.
Tape will push a mix together, it might round off transients, it might add a very unique movement in dynamic terms, a little push forward in the lows, maybe some softening in the highs almost like an accel limiter, even some "fizz and effervescence" if you have the right machine, but it wont add more space to a mix.
Density yes, space...... Nah...
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Re: How do you guys use U-He Satin?

Post by arkos »

English is not my native language and I must admit I'm rusty as hell typing it atm..... What I meant was Imo each instrument could be heard a little clearer in the mix then without the Tape plugin.

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Re: How do you guys use U-He Satin?

Post by Planar »

msl wrote:It's been living on my master bus since the day I bought it, always on, usually clean settings 30ips, sometimes I'll set it to vintage and 15ips. I always push the input so I'm just going in into the red a little.

I love it as a delay and flanger but its so damn cpu intensive in that role that I can only really use 1 instance in an already busy track, so I tend to use it rarely, need to use it more for flanger.
This, basically. Someone years ago (Steve?) advised to mix into and its been on my master ever since. I don't care how authentic it is, it just sounds great over a mix.

I've flirted with multiple instances in the summing mode, but it's still too much of a CPU hog for that, really. I've never tried the delay/flanger to this day- maybe I should.


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